Meet Management Software -- Pro's and Con's

[DonP]

EmmXC - athletic.net

1. simple athlete entry, uploads and downloads automatically
2. can't import times
3. powerful scoring
4. free
   

Hytek

1. powerful
2. accepts delimited data for entry
3. imports times
4. they want you to pay $39 for support
5. it is really expensive
   

Sydex

1. lots of folks got it
2. must use their entry system - won't work with athletic.net any more after Sept. 15, 2010
3. difficult interface, kind of clunky to use
4. moderately low priced
   

RaceTab

1. Free
2. Powerful
3. can download athletes from athletic.net
4. imports times
5. does wave races
   

RaceDirector

RunScore

[Derek Gonzales]

Good news, Hytek Meet Manager 3.0 comes out in October, with slightly simpler option packages. Bad news is that at this time it looks like their complicated (and in some cases, very expensive) licensing structure will remain in place.

On Sydex...can we assume they are going to release an "upgrade" patch in September? If so, I would bet that current users can save themselves the $15 upgrade fee (per sport) and continue to use the current versions that allows entries to be imported from athletic.net.

[DonP]

From what I understand, Sydex decided to do an upgrade to compel everyone to use their on-line registration system. I don't know what other enhancements may be included. They will only support the most recent version as I understand it. They feel that it is a violation of their software rights for people to be using a third party system and their new update will say that specifically to my understanding. I don't know what happens if you don't upgrade in terms of usability.

The problem with HyTek is that the last time they upgraded you were COMPELLED to pay the upgrade fee and yes they have a difficult fee structure. Although for the upgrade, it was one flat fee to upgrade. My older disks no longer work (which I only know because we tried loading one by mistake). I am not impressed with the idea that people have to pay for on-going support given the expense involved in acquiring the software and early reports on the enhancements aren't that impressive. I also don't know why you would want to do it mid-season -- I'd rather do it over the winter between cross and indoor if at all possible.

I'm thinking that raceTab is looking better and better. It works great with FAT. It does wave starts. It works with Sprint8 and many other timers. It is incredibly flexible and has many drag and drop editing features. The text editor is great.

[Carey]

Don,
What setup were you guys using at Kent City for the D3 Mitca Meet this year? RaceTab or HyTek?

Also do you have any experience networking 2 computers with the finish lynx camera so that it just flip flops which computer is capturing which events?

Thanks,
Carey

[DonP]

We used hytek at MITCA for D3 -- we have done a mitca for about five years so we have it all set up and ready to roll. We also used Hytek at the D1/D2. I think that D4 used Sydex.

We have not flip-flopped capture -- what you want to do is instead capture with one computer and read with another if you want to speed things up. MSU does this for example. However at D1/2 we were shooting 200's so fast that they asked us to slow down so if things are working correctly ... using a two computer setup (one for lynx and one for hytek/racetab) you can hum pretty good. If things aren't going well ... it doesn't matter :-)

With RaceTab it actually outputs the image so you can read remote if you wish.

Most typically we just use the serial cable link between computers. Derek Gonzales networks his, but I think he still just captures with one.

If you always only capture with one computer and evaluate with another there is no reason to alternate captures. I think MSU does alternating reads and two computers for girls/boys.

I'll probably play some more over the winter with some networking configurations.

[Carey]

Thanks,
We also use the serial cable and just have the camera/evaluator PC and then the HyTek. Generally we move along pretty good, only issues are if there is a large pool of a distance race, and we haven't planned appropriately. Generally for duel meets we just wait for a finish order sheet to come up, so evaluating that image might wait until the next distance event. But I can see if we used numbers like you guys did it'd be ok. We bought numbers and our AD only wants us using them for big meets. But just using regular sheets like you guys did was a great idea and something we might look into.

Thanks again!
Carey

[Derek Gonzales]

Carey,

We use a setup with 3 computers.

One is on full-time capture duty...that's the person that really needs to pay attention in order to get the race loaded right away and also watch/capture the finish. As soon as a race finishes, it is immediately saved, and the next race is loaded. This person doesn't even bother to look at the picture. Down-time between heats is typically 15 seconds unless there is a problem of some sort.

The second computer is for evaluation. This person can evaluate races at his/her leisure, and there is no pressure if they get behind.

The third computer is the scoring computer. As my crew has gotten better, my scoring guy has now started to help evaluate races too if we get backlogged. This is handy at the end of a big meet if you are trying to figure out who is who in the 2 mile heats, but you still want printed results done right after the 4x4. This helped out a little last year because at the end of our county meet, we had to go through and completely re-evaluate a heat of the 800 and change results manually because the clerk changed up heats without telling us. One person was able to do that, while the other person was able to continue evaluating the remaining races. If clerks and starters understand what's going on and work with you, you should be able to fly through heats with no downtime coming from the timers.

Network setup is very simple if you are using static IP addresses for each computer. All you need is a simple network switch ($20 - $60) and ethernet cables. I'd recommend an 8-port switch to give you a little flexibility. There are plenty of good, inexpensive options at http://www.newegg.com or at your local office supply store. If you are unfamiliar with how to setup IP addresses, follow the instructions in your finishlynx quick start guide.

I don't know if people have any bandwidth issues using a serial cable to send big lynx files to a second computer. With a standard 100MB network switch/cables, there should be no bottleneck. If your computers happen to have 1GB network cards, you can get a 10/100/1000 switch and Cat6 or Cat6A cables that are even faster.


Sample setup:
Capture computer: 192.168.0.5
Evaluating computer: 192.168.0.10
Scoring computer: 192.168.0.15
Your lynx camera will automatically set it's own IP address 1 number higher than the first computer you load up with the lynx software (192.168.0.6 in this case).

My setup will typically look something like this. It's a little more complicated, but the principle is the same:

Capture computer: static 192.168.05

Finishlynx camera: software assigned 192.168.06

Identilynx camera: software assigned 192.168.07

Evaluation computer: static 192.168.10

Scoring computer (laptop): 192.168.15 (ethernet adapter) & 192.168.16 (wireless adapter)

Networked Laser Printer: 192.168.0.20

Wireless access point at finishline: static 192.168.50

Wireless access point at pressbox: static 192.168.60

Probably too much information, but the short version is: get a network switch, plug in ethernet cables, manually set IP addresses, and you should be good to go.

---

For dual meets, we still use a 3 computer setup, but we also wait for the heat sheets to come up from the line. Then our evaluator will just line up the picture, get the time, then write them on the heat sheets. We post ALL the heat sheets up on a wall and visiting coaches can get all their kids FAT times. Our scorer will then manually enter times for the placers (and others only if time permits) into the scoring program. Then we can have printed results, at least for the scorers, as soon as the meet is finished. My scoring guy loves doing big meets since they are pre-seeded, and he doesn't have to manually enter all the results for races. Dual meets are more unpredictable, and thus more work in some ways.

[DonP]

This is not too much information Derek! Very helpful!

We seed our duals. We use ANet and cut off entries at 12:00 noon. Then we allow switches up to the first running event, but not after. Thankfully we are not using Sydex as that will not be an option after Sept. 15 when the go with their proprietary format.

Where are you physically placing the file? On computer two/evaluation?

Yes there can be a delay in transferring the entry files via the serial cable, as much as a minute which seems long, but you do it at most three or four times during a meet.

[Carey]

Great info Derek and Don!
Things went fairly smoothly for us in our first year with FinishLynx, but just wanting to pick everyone's brain for different ways to improve.

One quick question then I'll probably not have time to think about this until after XC.
Which computer is setup as the main storage spot on the network? I'd guess the capture computer?
So slightly more detailed but...you capture, save, get ready for next one. 2nd computer opens saved file from the shared network, evaluates, saves(back to the original spot?), then HyTek/scoring computer picks it up from there.
Is this mostly correct?

Thanks!
Carey
Shepherd High School

[Derek Gonzales]

Yes, that's the basic setup as you described it.

We have been using Sydex, just because we had it already, and it works with Lynx w/o any requiring any extra plugins. One of the things that I didn't like was that Sydex requires you to save your start lists on that computer, and I think the result files had to be there too, or they couldn't be uploaded. So for us, it was easiest to just create a folder for each meet on the scoring computer. The lynx software allows you to direct files and pull files from anywhere on the network, so it wasn't a problem. I guess if I had a choice, I'd keep files on the fastest computer (which I'd probably use for capturing). If you have decent hardware, it really shouldn't matter probably. I'm going to try and find time to play around with RaceTab in the next few months. Sydex was fine for the most part, but we'll have to see if we can still use the old version for Anet downloads because I'm not ready to start paying for online entries. I wouldn't mind so much plopping down the cash for Hytek 3.0 with all the bells and whistles ($1000+), but their licensing still irritates me. If I time a 1-2 meets in the summer, away from my home site, and without my team competing, "technically" it's against the licensing agreement. Am I supposed to pay $1000 per year for an Independent Contractor's License to do a couple extra meets? Fat chance!

The only time we had any network problems...and this was just a learning experience...was when we did our first few distance races using the Identilynx camera last year. We have a Finishlynx Fusion, which already has a higher resolution & color depths (and thus bigger file sizes), and when we added the video from the IDlynx, the file sizes were pretty massive in comparison. Our capture computer seemed to hang for about 1-5 minutes when we saved those races to our scoring computer. We has to hold up a couple races, which I hate doing. What I figured out was that we had our scoring computer (laptop) running on Wi-Fi in another room, and when we had REALLY big files, it was slowing down the save process. The next meet, we just hardwired it again with an ethernet cable and the saves were instant, no matter how huge the files were. With a standard Etherlynx 2000 camera and no Identilynx, the file sizes are a tiny fraction of what we ran into there, so it shouldn't be any concern. For whatever it's worth...the Identilynx is a pretty nice (albeit expensive) add-on!